What's the damage likely to be?

[dromia]

Getting the source to fix it is the right thing to do but he will probably offer a refund, if he does this then the OP is in a place he doesn't want to be regarding variations.

Regardless of the outcome a parts kit is a must have with these guns, replacing/smoothing the internals will fix most problems unless the frame/cylinder/barrel is buggered.

There are reasons why parts kits are so readily available for these guns.

[MistAgain]

Forget about the variation problems , yes he will be inconvenienced for a time waiting for the licence changes , but it is at no cost , and lets be honest , it is not a matter of life and death .

He will be much better with a full refund , even if it does get fixed , would you have confidence in a gun that has been so badly misdiscribed ?

Another thing to consider , why did the dealer who did the transfer not point out these problems before he filled in the FAC . The damage to the nipples and hammer must have been clearly visible .

[legs748]

Replacing the nipples and hammer would be a piece of p1ss to do but be aware that internal bits may need some hand fitting to make things work properly. Replacing a hand and spring in my pietta took about an hour with the needle files so if you are not confident with that sort of thing seek outside help.

[dromia]

He will be much better with a full refund , even if it does get fixed , would you have confidence in a gun that has been so badly misdiscribed ?

For me descriptions are only one persons view of the firearm, other than the few people whose descriptions I personally trust I only rely on what I see.

[redcat]

I'd go with getting some satisfaction from the seller - a partial refund at least to cover the cost of the parts. I think £130 is a bit steep for fitting nipples and a hammer. If you lived a bit nearer I'd fit them for free. If you do get some recompense and fancy having a go yourself I should be able to fix you up with the nipples FOC.

Redcat

[Dark Skies]

Cheers everyone.

As the situation stands I've contacted the RFD that sold me the gun outlining my dissatisfaction to see what he has to say.
Hopefully he'll be minded to do the right thing and put things right. For all I know he'll be shocked and full of remorse. I did get the impression he didn't have much to do with BP - I think it was a trade in - so he possibly is completely unaware of there being issues.

The gun is currently with a dealer in Wiltshire who has some experience with black powder firearms to be sent off to his gunsmith - so it's not actually on a work bench as yet. I could have brought it back with me but the nearest appropriate gun shop is a 100 mile round trip so it'd be a bit of a faff to then have to take it back. If it needs to go back to the original seller then it can just as easily be sent from where it is.

At the moment I'm on a good legal footing as a consumer - which is why I'm reluctant to start fiddling about in its guts as an amateur because then I'd have broken the chain and would leave myself wide open to claims of having arsed it up myself.

It might be the guesstimate is very wide of the mark - this was off the top of the head of the guy on the counter. To me the job looks fiddly and time consuming (other than the nipples) with a need for skilled fitting. To a gunsmith it might be a trifling job he can do whilst drinking his tea and may be only half an hour's work plus parts.

I may not have mentioned that this is the stainless RGS44 model - Henry Krank list them as £450 new so I figured an 'as new' condition second hand example for £150 was a bit of a bargain. Especially so as black powder is a new venture for me - zero experience and so I didn't want to lay out a lot of money as a newbie.
I might not get on with it so £450 plus all the expense of tools, powder, caps, etc. would be a lot of cash to have spent on a toy.

The barrel and cylinder are in good shape - I doubt if they get the same through put as modern easy to load firearms. So assuming the known faults are all that's wrong it could still end up being a good purchase. Especially if the dealer accepts the matter with good grace and makes things right.

[Hunter87]

Keep us update I'm keen to know how this gets sorted.

[Dark Skies]

Keep us update I'm keen to know how this gets sorted.

The RFD emailed me on Sunday (which impressed me)
"sorry to hear this although i didnt fire it as such i did put caps on it and fired it in that manner and it worked fine i will arrange collection on monday as im interested in their assesment if they are correct i will refund you no problem if thats what you would prefer if not let me know what they suggest it would cost to rectify it to your sattisfaction."

Heartened by the response I suggested that maybe he should phone the dealer I left it with a view to getting a better idea and maybe, rather than the expense of having it couriered to them that he requested some photos of the areas of concern instead. It just seemed to me that every time it gets moved about the country it costs a further £25 on top.

I don't know what the trade charge each other for this sort of repair - so I've had to assume for the moment that the ball park figure is correct-ish. It seems to me essential to keep unnecessary costs down given the sale price of the pistol. If a kit of parts will bring the gun up to the described condition then I'm happy. So yesterday I was fairly relaxed about the issue.

Today - not so much. I received this in my email today:
" i will ring RFD during the day but from my point of view i think a return and inspection by ourselves is the way forward,and if its as bad as reported i will just refund you i cant get into spending £130 rebuilding a £150 gun it makes no sense economically if theres as much wrong with it as has been pointed out."

Now, whilst I totally get this from his point of view as a business, my gut feeling is not so platonic.

The gun plus shipping cost £175 all in. On top of that I had to pay my local dealer £35 to handle the delivery and paperwork. So assuming a full refund is issued I'm going to be down £35. I've also spent some money on loading tools and consumables specific to this calibre which I won't be able to use for quite some time as I'll need to endure another four months whilst TVP take it off my FAC and then vary it for the same calibre.

The alternative (and to be clear this is just me thinking ahead - I've had no further word as yet) is that the RFD pays for the necessary parts to fix the gun and I fit them myself to cut the expense of a gunsmith doing it. Whilst this cuts out a lot of the problems and still leaves a viable deal for both parties I have to admit my gut reaction is "why should I be left to clean this mess up? I bought in good faith!"

Ultimately the decision as to whether a refund is issued (if it goes that way in the end) or not lies with me - I am the legal owner so it can't be forced on me. But I do feel I'm being left to clean up someone else's mess.

This is why I always make sure that whenever I'm selling something I make sure it's BETTER than as described - so I don't find myself in the same situation as this RFD. It's all feels like it's becoming a bit of a saga now.

But as I said no word yet - maybe the seller will bite the bullet and make me happy.

[Dark Skies]

As an aside. The dealer that I took it to does know a fair bit about BP revolvers as he has them himself. He said he would not shoot my pistol with nipples in that condition.

I have been told really worn nipples can lead to chain fires. Apparently the flash from one cap getting past the worn section of a nipple and entering into the next. Is that really a possibility? Seems unlikely to me but I am sufficiently concerned to find out.

[redcat]

I'd send it back and go with a refund. Ring your firearms licensing and explain the situation - they may be able to do you a fast turnaround.
Chain fires happen from the front of the cylinder.

Redcat