What SMG is this?

[bradaz11]

well then, I won't spend any more time looking

gonna go have some lunch instead

[Rarms]

Lower is H&K derived, I would guess maybe a POF or FMP product?

[HALODIN]

Where abouts in the world are you?

well then, I won't spend any more time looking

gonna go have some lunch instead

[bradaz11]

Camelot... Tis a silly place


Nah
Bristol

[HALODIN]

It is a different timezone to be fair!

I've given up looking for that SMG, I can't find it, I have no idea what it is, which makes me think it's either not real or home made.

Nah
Bristol

[Sim G]

Can anyone identify the polymer SMG? Looks similar to an MP40, presumably 9mm and presumably it fires from an open bolt. Anyone?

Ooooh, a Zagi m91! A Croatian made, bog standard open bolt, box mag smg with a retractable stock. Rare and collectible now. Came out of the ruins of the war in FYR when Croatia was attempting to establish itself and the rest of the world hit them with this embargo and that embargo.

Necessity the mother of all invention. But, as has been seen by the Croatian arms industry since, this was a well made, well finished bit of kit that filled a need at the time. I've not seen one in a couple of decades, but then, my job's different now and I'd imagine these are encountered rarely outside of the Balkans.

[HALODIN]

Well done that man! Interestingly the wiki article says it's mechanism was based on the Sten gun, but it looks like it was based on the MP40 to me, unless they're just referring to the barrel shroud.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zagi_M-91

[Sim G]

The mech no doubt refers to the simplicity of the design, being that the bolt is just a big lump of steel, with a fixed firing pin and an extractor claw. Which flies forward when released and the slamming of the bolt against the breech, fires the cartridge. Likewise, there is no locking of the bolt, relying purely on the weight of the bolt itself and the resistance of the spring, to hold the bolt closed whilst pressure remains at its peak, overcoming this resistance when pressure drops, "blows back", extracts and ejects case.

[HALODIN]

Yes but doesn't that apply to both the sten and the MP40?

[Sim G]

No, the MP40 was a far more complicated weapon than the Sten! It had buffer tubes and spring tubes and firing pin and all manner of complicated and refined stuff! Lol. The Germans wished they'd made something as simple as the Sten, but then did at the end of the war with a blatant knock-off of the Sten, with the MP3008.

Function doesn't always follow form. The Zagi may resemble an MP40 because of the magazine location then open bolt firing, but that's it. Just look at the Cetme and the HK P9S. Both roller locking of Spanish origin....