Distance Sales Sticky

[Christel]

If a firearm is being purchased and then sold by the receiving RFD and the RFD is VAT registered then 16.67% VAT is added on any profit.

If the firearm is bought with the buyer's money then if no valid slot then there is something about not having the right to purchase.

[Christel]

So i send off my FAC to purchase a gun and it goes missing for a month , so I am not allowed out with my guns as i cannot if stopped produce a current FAC ? I have guns at home that i cant produce a current FAC for ? )(and in Essex your own license and the police copy is not always the same ). So i am breaking the law surely ?

so you don't go out shooting when you apply for a variation?

I always hang on to my FAC when applying for a variation/renewal (I include a copy of my FAC with the application) until I have the new one in my hand, then I send the old one in. Signed for.

One can still shoot in the county one lives in if FAC is in for variation/renewal. Just not buy ammo.

[Chapuis]

So i send off my FAC to purchase a gun and it goes missing for a month , so I am not allowed out with my guns as i cannot if stopped produce a current FAC ? I have guns at home that i cant produce a current FAC for ? )(and in Essex your own license and the police copy is not always the same ). So i am breaking the law surely ?

so you don't go out shooting when you apply for a variation?

I always hang on to my FAC when applying for a variation/renewal (I include a copy of my FAC with the application) until I have the new one in my hand, then I send the old one in. Signed for.

One can still shoot in the county one lives in if FAC is in for variation/renewal. Just not buy ammo.

Not just the county Christel as there's no actual requirement to carry your FAC with you when out and about with your firearms, after all you still hold a valid certificate you just don't happen to have the actual document to hand while it is away for variation/renewal. Like yourself I always hold on to my certificates when applying for a variation or renewal and exchange it for the new document when that is available. Also as you say if you do send your FAC in when applying for a variation you will then not be able to buy ammunition or some reloading components (primers or expanding bullets).

[Dellboy]

So i send off my FAC to purchase a gun and it goes missing for a month , so I am not allowed out with my guns as i cannot if stopped produce a current FAC ? I have guns at home that i cant produce a current FAC for ? )(and in Essex your own license and the police copy is not always the same ). So i am breaking the law surely ?

so you don't go out shooting when you apply for a variation?

as Essex take about 4 months for a variation i keep it until the new one is ready .

[Robert303]

Could the buyer not send his FAC to the sellers RFD. Seller goes into RFD with gun. Seller fills out FAC and notifies police. On receipt of money he advises RFD to send gun to buyers RFD. Buyer collects gun and advises police. Either the seller can return the FAC or even better this RFD does.

[bradaz11]

Could the buyer not send his FAC to the sellers RFD. Seller goes into RFD with gun. Seller fills out FAC and notifies police. On receipt of money he advises RFD to send gun to buyers RFD. Buyer collects gun and advises police. Either the seller can return the FAC or even better this RFD does.

that's what I keep saying

[dromia]

As I keep saying firearms certification are the ones to ask about this, they are calling the shots. We are just speculating until a ruling is given.

[Blackstuff]

Not just the county Christel as there's no actual requirement to carry your FAC with you when out and about with your firearms, after all you still hold a valid certificate you just don't happen to have the actual document to hand while it is away for variation/renewal. Like yourself I always hold on to my certificates when applying for a variation or renewal and exchange it for the new document when that is available. Also as you say if you do send your FAC in when applying for a variation you will then not be able to buy ammunition or some reloading components (primers or expanding bullets).

There is however an offence possible if you cannot produce your FAC/SGC if asked fro by an officer. Worse case scenario this could lead to your guns being confiscated until you can produce your original FAC/SGC. Might not be too bad if it happens locally (your guns would go to the nearest station to the pull), might be a lot more hassle if you're away shooting at the other end of the country...

[Chapuis]

Not just the county Christel as there's no actual requirement to carry your FAC with you when out and about with your firearms, after all you still hold a valid certificate you just don't happen to have the actual document to hand while it is away for variation/renewal. Like yourself I always hold on to my certificates when applying for a variation or renewal and exchange it for the new document when that is available. Also as you say if you do send your FAC in when applying for a variation you will then not be able to buy ammunition or some reloading components (primers or expanding bullets).

There is however an offence possible if you cannot produce your FAC/SGC if asked fro by an officer. Worse case scenario this could lead to your guns being confiscated until you can produce your original FAC/SGC. Might not be too bad if it happens locally (your guns would go to the nearest station to the pull), might be a lot more hassle if you're away shooting at the other end of the country...

What would that offence be then and how would it be worded on the charge sheet?
As you say the worse case scenario is if the officer were unable to verify your identity and the fact that you held the appropriate FAC or SGC in which case he could seize the firearms until you are able to establish your identity. These days with good communications networks and central records an officer shouldn't have any difficulty in verifying that you possess the necessary at any time of the day or night.

The question of the need to carry your FAC or SGC comes up with great frequency in shooting magazines and on websites. The plain simple answer is that there is no requirement for you to do so though many would argue that it may be advisable. I'm fairly sure that there is something on the BASC website as a "sticky".

[NoEntry]

This is what the act says

Production of certificates.
(1)A constable may demand, from any person whom he believes to be in possession of a firearm or ammunition to which section 1 of this Act applies, or of a shot gun, the production of his firearm certificate or, as the case may be, his shot gun certificate.
F1[(1A)Where a person upon whom a demand has been made by a constable under subsection (1) above and whom the constable believes to be in possession of a firearm fails—
(a)to produce a firearm certificate or, as the case may be, a shot gun certificate;
(b)to show that he is a person who, by reason of his place of residence or any other circumstances, is not entitled to be issued with a document identifying that firearm under any of the provisions which in the other member States correspond to the provisions of this Act for the issue of European firearms passes; or
(c)to show that he is in possession of the firearm exclusively in connection with the carrying on of activities in respect of which, he or the person on whose behalf he has possession of the firearm, is recognised, for the purposes of the law of another member State relating to firearms, as a collector of firearms or a body concerned in the cultural or historical aspects of weapons,the constable may demand from that person the production of a document which has been issued to that person in another member State under any such corresponding provisions, identifies that firearm as a firearm to which it relates and is for the time being valid.]
(2)If a person upon whom a demand is made under this section fails to produce the certificate [F2or document] or to permit the constable to read it, or to show that he is entitled by virtue of this Act to have the firearm, ammunition or shot gun in his possession without holding a certificate, the constable may seize and detain the firearm, ammunition or shot gun and may require the person to declare to him immediately his name and address.
(3)If under this section a person is required to declare to a consta ble his name and address, it is an offence for him to refuse to declare it or to fail to give his true name and address.
F3[(4)It is an offence for a person who is in possession of a firearm to fail to comply with a demand under subsection (1A) above.]