Benchrest and F Class gun handling

[woody_rod]

I see there are a few f classers on this forum, and no doubt some that shoot benchrest as well. I have been shooting f class on and off now for a couple of years, and have come to a point where I want to go further with my shooting, scores etc. Funny how people that know I make rifles for a living, somehow expect it makes me an instant good shooter as well. Obviously, these are two different things.

Knowing the rifle I am using does shoot very well, I still have issues with some underlying gun handling or something that is giving me problems with elevation. This has been with me consitently through shooting in F Class since starting in the discipline.

Ok, so how do I improve on this, but in a measured way in order to know how to measure the improvement? Being an engineer type, I have to be able to measure things

One thing is that I use my F std rifle as a basis for the f open one, having he same trigger pull to save time. This means a 1kg trigger pull, which is likely part of the problem.

It is annoying to read conditions well enough to stay inside the width of the 6 ring, yet to have high and low shots losing points!!

If it is gun handling, which is likely, what practice or method should I use for better elevation?

Some options I can think of, and to get some feedback on: I have an Anschutz smallbore rifle, which can be modified easily to shoot over the same rests etc as the F open rifle (add 3 inch wide flat plate and scope etc, will this help at say 50 or 100 yards? I know it will be a lot cheaper than the f open rifle, and save the barrel. If shooting on the ISSF 50m target, this should show any positional or handling issues?

[Actionclear]

The real title should be...

I want to beat my wife in shooting. Please help me! :lol:

My suggestion is to change your rear bag, or fill it up more. It's to soft and squashy on the butt cheeks.

[R.G.C]

The real title should be...

I want to beat my wife in shooting. Please help me! :lol:

My suggestion is to change your rear bag, or fill it up more. It's to soft and squashy on the butt cheeks.

Linda,

Hope he never tried to beat you otherwise???.....

R.G.C

[Ovenpaa]

Actionclear is right in that your rear bag will make a big difference to the tracking of the rifle, fill the rear bag up until it is very tightly packed but still allows the butt to fit correctly, the ears on some bags are very poorly designed but SEB rear bags seem good in this respect and are very reasonably priced in comparison to some. Also look at the shape of the butt and it's fit in the bag (Christel has a 180x20mm aluminium bar as a rear rider that nestles nicely in the bag) Also over filling the front bag seems to knock accuracy down a bit.

Over here people shoot with 'heavy sand' however I have not tried it yet. Apparently foundry sand makes a good alternative.

On a personal note I am used to shooting off a bipod and realised with a front rest that my grip would pull the rifle around slightly so these days I shoot with a very soft hold and use my shoulder as a stop with it barely touching the butt. It is not free recoil but minimal contact. Returning the rifle to the front stop is important as it means you always shoot from the same reference point.

Trigger wise I much prefer a two stage with a fairly low break. My Barnard has the Barnard trigger set to around 750 grams and my Accuracy International trigger has been set to as close as I can to this for repeatability. Interestingly the 'nicest' trigger I have is a Brindles box on a P14, it just feels right (95 year old rifle and 50 year old box)

This is a good topic and I would also be interested in any pointers on the subject, our resident BR shooter TGP will know far more on this subject and should be along in a while :)

[Actionclear]

My husband has morals Robert.

I picked Rod's bag up yesterday to move it, and my fingers sunk into the ears. I'm not sure what he has used to fill his bag up. I have filled mine with fine granite powder.

[woody_rod]

My husband has morals Robert.

I picked Rod's bag up yesterday to move it, and my fingers sunk into the ears. I'm not sure what he has used to fill his bag up. I have filled mine with fine granite powder.

Oooh baby...

I refilled the large bottom section of the bag this week, but not the ears. I think the bag design is not really that great, with actionclears being a lot better. Mine is all leather, with some denim I glued on the inside to reduce friction. The other one has a lot less friction than mine, as it is made from cordura or whatever. Mine also has higher ears, which are annoying and unnecessary. Both are Protektor brand. Mine is the 13A model, actionclears is the 14BDBB.

I also think the cordura bag is much too light and low. Mine has a piece of 5/8" steel plate and same of rubber matt glued to the bottom to stop it moving, and to make it a fair bit higher.

The butt of all our rifles are quite narrow, so they don't grip the side of the bag much. Seems to work well, plus we find it hard to get the widely spaced bags at times, 2 or 3 stitch etc

How much filling should we use for the front bag???

[Ovenpaa]

Cordura for the ears seems to work better for me, front bag filling... well I have mine soft enough to squidge it around but I am still not convinced it is right. If the front bag is soft then sand moves around inside it which can lead to small peaks and troughs and lack of consistency.

I do wonder if a cast front bag is the way to go, use something like a soft silicone rubber (like bath sealant) which will still deform with finger pressure. The idea being cast it to slightly larger than the bottom and sides of your fore-end and then cover it with a PTFE tape so it is a good fit yet you can still lift the rifle off without resistance. Think of it as bedding your rifle fore end to the rest. If it is legal in BR and the F classes it might work quite well. This does of course raise some ethical issues however if nothing else it could be used for testing outside of competitions.

[woody_rod]

Cordura for the ears seems to work better for me, front bag filling... well I have mine soft enough to squidge it around but I am still not convinced it is right. If the front bag is soft then sand moves around inside it which can lead to small peaks and troughs and lack of consistency.

I do wonder if a cast front bag is the way to go, use something like a soft silicone rubber (like bath sealant) which will still deform with finger pressure. The idea being cast it to slightly larger than the bottom and sides of your fore-end and then cover it with a PTFE tape so it is a good fit yet you can still lift the rifle off without resistance. Think of it as bedding your rifle fore end to the rest. If it is legal in BR and the F classes it might work quite well. This does of course raise some ethical issues however if nothing else it could be used for testing outside of competitions.

Our local rules in AU don't allow for anything other than a "finely divided" substance, like sand etc.

I have had a lot of trouble previously with the rifle jumping and grabbing on the bags. Now we use the other type, it seems to be a lot better.

I wonder what I am doing wrong with the rifle to make the elevation move like it does. On average it is about 1 minute at any range, sometimes a bit more. This is usually only 2-3 shots in 12 outside a very good elevation. This gives lost points, and more aggravation.

[Ovenpaa]

Our local rules in AU don't allow for anything other than a "finely divided" substance, like sand etc.

I have had a lot of trouble previously with the rifle jumping and grabbing on the bags. Now we use the other type, it seems to be a lot better.

I wonder what I am doing wrong with the rifle to make the elevation move like it does. On average it is about 1 minute at any range, sometimes a bit more. This is usually only 2-3 shots in 12 outside a very good elevation. This gives lost points, and more aggravation.

Thinking about it a solid front bag would not be legal over here either.

Are you confident the flyers are completely down to the way you support the rifle?

[woody_rod]

Our local rules in AU don't allow for anything other than a "finely divided" substance, like sand etc.

I have had a lot of trouble previously with the rifle jumping and grabbing on the bags. Now we use the other type, it seems to be a lot better.

I wonder what I am doing wrong with the rifle to make the elevation move like it does. On average it is about 1 minute at any range, sometimes a bit more. This is usually only 2-3 shots in 12 outside a very good elevation. This gives lost points, and more aggravation.

Thinking about it a solid front bag would not be legal over here either.

Are you confident the flyers are completely down to the way you support the rifle?

It was also more neck tension it seems previously. I am confident that it is rifle handling yes.