Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rifle.

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acormack
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Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rifle.

#1 Post by acormack »

Evening everyone

I am going to put a variation in for a full bore target rifle and wondered what everyone's thoughts are on a beginners first full bore target rifle? I've been shooting small bore for a few years now and fancy having a go at the longer range stuff. I see a few Parker Hales and Musgraves at reasonable prices, should they be avoided or are they all that's needed for cheap practice until the scores start improving?

I know everyone will say buy a good rifle for a first gun but I've just spent quite a bit upgrading to an alloy stocked .22 so that's not going to happen anytime soon, her indoors will kick me out the house if I do lol.

I'll go for a 308 but has anyone dealt with Inverness and are they flexible with 308 or 7.62 x 51 on my FAC? I notice Fultons of Bisley list their rifles as 308/7.62 and is this the way to go for a variation?

Any advice would be gratefully received, send me a pm if need be.

Thanks in advance
Alan
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Pete
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#2 Post by Pete »

Musgrave, and put 308/7.62 on your application.............

Pete
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acormack
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#3 Post by acormack »

Cheers Pete, those were my thoughts as well.
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#4 Post by Pippin89 »

From memory Parker Hale and Musgrave both use Mauser actions (someone correct me if I am wrong) so if that's the case the real difference will be the stock.
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#5 Post by Pete »

The Musgrave is an "improved" Mauser, a single shot very accurate target rifle, whereas the Parker-Hale is a standard Mauser AFAIK, with a magazine well.
Still an excellent tool, though, especially if you can find one with the later Spanish made action and a Brindles trigger
My current 6BR is a Musgrave, and we ran a PH 1200TX for a couple of years.

Pete
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#6 Post by Pippin89 »

Pete wrote:The Musgrave is an "improved" Mauser, a single shot very accurate target rifle, whereas the Parker-Hale is a standard Mauser AFAIK, with a magazine well.
Still an excellent tool, though, especially if you can find one with the later Spanish made action and a Brindles trigger
My current 6BR is a Musgrave, and we ran a PH 1200TX for a couple of years.

Pete
Thanks for the clarification. I have an M98 in a target stock. Its an older one with a fixed mag but I have got a follower to convert it to single shot.
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#7 Post by acormack »

Pete, are the spares difficult to get for a Musgrave? I read somewhere that these guns are getting older (obviously!) and the spares are drying up or is that just the keyboard warriors working overtime?
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#8 Post by Laurie »

Pippin89 wrote:
Pete wrote:The Musgrave is an "improved" Mauser, a single shot very accurate target rifle, whereas the Parker-Hale is a standard Mauser AFAIK, with a magazine well.
Still an excellent tool, though, especially if you can find one with the later Spanish made action and a Brindles trigger
My current 6BR is a Musgrave, and we ran a PH 1200TX for a couple of years.

Pete
Thanks for the clarification. I have an M98 in a target stock. Its an older one with a fixed mag but I have got a follower to convert it to single shot.
All you do there is fill he hole in the action floor. Given an equally large hole in the top of the action, you have a design with two large, heavy chunks of metal held together by relatively shallow side rails that have been machined and thinned with bolt raceways. Nothing wrong with that as many accurate rifles have been built on M98 actions, but not as good as one designed for single-shot competition from the drawing board. The Swing/Paramount/ RPA series and Musgrave have stronger receivers and far fewer openings - just a smaller 308 length loading / ejection port on one side.

Many P-Hs use enhanced military M98s (P-H bought 98 actions from the Spanish government La Corunna arsenal - Americans usually call them Santa Barbara actions after the name of the Californian US distributor), but later models used the '98 bolt alone surrounded by a P-H designed and manufactured single-shot action, a perfectly good one. This was the various P-H M84 single-shot models, M86 repeating police and military model with a magazine opening machined into the floor, and the further enhanced M85 entrant to the UK MoD sniper rifle procurement trials (an excellent rifle, but it lost out to the Accuracy International entrant).

In practical terms, there's little between a Musgrave RSA Target Rifle and an M84, choice depending more on how well the stock fits and crucially in buying such a secondhand rifle, the barrel make, round count and condition. P-H made its own hammer forged barrels which were rarely as good as a cut or button-rifled Krieger, Maddco, Border etc put on a Musgrave or Swing. Very few of these 1970s/80s rifles still bear their originals (and most that do are shot out), so what has been put on subsequently and its condition is vital to how well it'll now shoot.

Iron match rearsights also wear out after decades of use and being clicked up and down and across thousands of times, play building up in their dovetail joints. P-H made its own sights and they weren't as good as many of the others in use and on older rifles they tend to be worn out. Replacing such a rearsight is an expensive business and many Swings, RPAs, Musgraves have had them replaced / upgraded by highly competitive owners over their lives - what's on a rifle and its age / condition has a considerable effect on what Fultons price a TR rifle at. I wouldn't say that no P-H owner ever put a new, higher-grade rearsight on, but such will be in the hen's teeth category whereas many higher grade makes will sport a later model less-used example, also adjustable height foresight assembly which may or may not be desirable to you depending on whether you plan to shoot long-range.

Second-hand TR rifles can be a bit like used cars - cheap can get you on the road/range but the shortcomings become apparent after a while and you end up buying twice instead of once.
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#9 Post by acormack »

I had a look at a Carl Gustaf target rifle locally yesterday, I think its a CG63 after looking them up online and it was in really tidy condition. How do they fare and what would the current market value for a tidy one be?? Is the Musgrave a better rifle than both the PH and Carl Gustaf? Just asking before I decide which way to go, any views would be great.
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Re: Parker Hale or Musgrave for a first full bore target rif

#10 Post by Pete »

Spares for the Muzzie & PH can be found.......I broke the extractor on mine and got a used one from Fultons for a tenner.........RPA and Davies make triggers for the Musgrave.
But it's already been mentioned that the Musgrave is a purpose built single shot target action with a massive and stiff receiver that will last for ever (probably)...........

Pete
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