Gun storage - exceptions to general rules

[Mattnall]

I think the post reads to me that it was left there as a expedient thing. Perhaps the owner wanted to go somewhere and rather than take the pistol with them thought it better to leave it in the club store.

Some FAC holders have to store their firearms at a club as part of their conditions but I've always thought they would be in a separate cabinet to the club guns or with an on-site RFD.

[bradaz11]

I dont understand why a FAC holder would get a variation for a long barrel pistol then want to store it at a Club.

for convenience?

I'm starting to look at the possibilities of storing at minimum a rifle, shotgun and 2 muzzle loading pistols, along with their assorted ammos, at a range.
I want to do this because I'm travelling more, and comps start sat morning, this way if I fly home at 9pm to london, I don't have to go to Bristol, then to grimsby, instead I can go straight to grimsby. and shoot that morning. saving me from a 6+ hr detour and instead only being 2-3hrs.


as for the club locker question, its probably also to do with it being a club locker, I was under the impression that if you belong to a club, your personal firearms can't just be left on the club ticket ad hoc. they are personal. its the club guns that can be lent to you, not yours to them. so they are then in possession of a gun not on the club fac and not eligible to be on a club fac. it should have been lodged with the RFD and put in the RFD area.
most clubs Ive seen where you can leave guns either have a safe you can rent, therefore you are storing your firearms safely and they have no access so they stay only as your responsibility, they are just supplying the security side.
either that or the club has an RFD, and a secure armoury where only the rfd / staff can go or accompany you to limit your access, and the guns are stored there, and so on their register.

[DanTheMan]

Our club has a locker where only the member has access to the firearms, they are listed on the members FAC not the clubs, it's for convenience expecially as members arrive by train. No one else at the club can access the locker.

[hitchphil]

I dont understand why a FAC holder would get a variation for a long barrel pistol then want to store it at a Club.

for convenience?

I'm starting to look at the possibilities of storing at minimum a rifle, shotgun and 2 muzzle loading pistols, along with their assorted ammos, at a range.
I want to do this because I'm travelling more, and comps start sat morning, this way if I fly home at 9pm to london, I don't have to go to Bristol, then to grimsby, instead I can go straight to grimsby. and shoot that morning. saving me from a 6+ hr detour and instead only being 2-3hrs.


as for the club locker question, its probably also to do with it being a club locker, I was under the impression that if you belong to a club, your personal firearms can't just be left on the club ticket ad hoc. they are personal. its the club guns that can be lent to you, not yours to them. so they are then in possession of a gun not on the club fac and not eligible to be on a club fac. it should have been lodged with the RFD and put in the RFD area.
most clubs Ive seen where you can leave guns either have a safe you can rent, therefore you are storing your firearms safely and they have no access so they stay only as your responsibility, they are just supplying the security side.
either that or the club has an RFD, and a secure armoury where only the rfd / staff can go or accompany you to limit your access, and the guns are stored there, and so on their register.

My club has a members cabinet in an armoury room, that cab has a welded in wire. Members can rack rifles in it & long loop padlock the rifle via the action port to the wire, then put bolt & a notional amount of ammo in a cash box on the shelf. 10 guns can be stored, only the owners & me have the code to the armoury & cabinet padlock & only the owners have the key to their guns padlock. I have 3 members issued FAC on the basis thats their storage solution.

My guns are in a separate cabinet in that same armoury room, I can have my guns there or at home, as i wish. My cabinets can contain a number of club guns too, as the FAC holder, I can have some here to work on, store, out of use, sell etc. its flexible safe & FLO was happy with that.

[RDC]

Now that is interesting .
This is actual fact : Member leaves Taurus LBR at club , locked up with club guns .
Police visit club and find Taurus while checking club guns .
Police opinion was that it should have been stored with the RFD's guns and listed on their register .
FAC was revoked .

Wasn't this the case with the Liverpool club where the police shut it down?

[Pippin89]

Now that is interesting .
This is actual fact : Member leaves Taurus LBR at club , locked up with club guns .
Police visit club and find Taurus while checking club guns .
Police opinion was that it should have been stored with the RFD's guns and listed on their register .
FAC was revoked .

Wasn't this the case with the Liverpool club where the police shut it down?

Yes rings a bell. Think it was the secretary's gun wasn't it? Although I think there was also another issue with a "club gun" which actually belonged to a member who had their FAC denied or revoked?... Might be misremembering that but its somewhere in the old clockwork.

[paul mercer]

I store guns at a club. I take some of them on my non-shooting day home. I do some kind of maintenance, and put them back on the same day. - quite normal i do this all the time & with club guns i just take them home & store alongside my own

The club guns thing is a little used or understood exemption to the need for an FAC. A full HO club member can take club guns and ammo for club purposes, be that cleaning, shooting away etc. even if they do not hold an FAC.

Now that is interesting .
This is actual fact : Member leaves Taurus LBR at club , locked up with club guns .
Police visit club and find Taurus while checking club guns .
Police opinion was that it should have been stored with the RFD's guns and listed on their register .
FAC was revoked .

The LBP/R is a different thing altogether. Clubs cannot have LBP/R on their FAC and as there is no approval by the HO for LBP/R clubs the club exemption from the need to have an FAC to handle firearms is not relevant in this instance. As any club full member could have access to the club locker and the club's firearms they could get access to the pistol as well. Stopping unauthorised access is a condition of an FAC. Most likely a legitimate revocation.

'Quote'
'The club guns thing is a little used or understood exemption to the need for an FAC. A full HO club member can take club guns and ammo for club purposes, be that cleaning, shooting away etc. even if they do not hold an FAC'.
Could you enlighten me a bit on this one, as I understand it from my own club if a club rifle is to be taken out of the club for use on another range or for maintenance the person taking it out should not only have a FAC of their own but must request and have a written authority from the club chairman or secretary to do so and even then they may have to clear it with the police first, otherwise if the person carrying it is stopped by the police they are in effect in possession of a firearm which is not on their certificate.
Also, I understand that when storing ones own guns in the club armoury they are not covered under the club insurance and should be covered by the owners.
insurance.
Am I right or wrong on this?

[DanTheMan]

A member of a rifle club approved by the Secretary of State may, without holding a firearm certificate, have in his possession a rifle and ammunition when engaged as a member of the club in connection with target shooting.

Just read the legislation, it's all there, no need to overcomplicate it:
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/19 ... view=plain

[paul mercer]

Thanks for that, but as I read it it applies to a member of a club who does not have an FAC to enable them to use the club guns on the club premises, I cannot see that it authorises a club member who does not have a FAC to take a club gun to another range.
What can be done however is for the club chairman or secretary to give written authority to authorise a specified FAC holder to take the club gun to that range for the non FAC member to use, providing it is returned to the club armoury at the end of the shoot.

[Chapuis]

Thanks for that, but as I read it it applies to a member of a club who does not have an FAC to enable them to use the club guns on the club premises, I cannot see that it authorises a club member who does not have a FAC to take a club gun to another range.
What can be done however is for the club chairman or secretary to give written authority to authorise a specified FAC holder to take the club gun to that range for the non FAC member to use, providing it is returned to the club armoury at the end of the shoot.

It certainly does permit a club member (that is a full club member) to take a firearm to another club to compete or to take it to a gunsmith for repair.
No where does it mention that they must be the holder of a firearms certificate. I don't recall seeing anything about written consent either, perhaps that's just a club rule that you may have in your club.