A discussion on the role of the NRA and it’s future.

[Gaz]

I have to say, as great as Bisley is (when was the last time Century butts were swept out, by the way?), I wouldn't join the NRA itself. The only tangible benefit I can see is the ability to hire targets at Bisley in your own name rather than going through a club. For the rest - media representation, firearms licensing advice, etc - BASC seem to be the go-to people.

For me, speaking as an impoverished target shooter who can only dream of having enough moolah for one gun per discipline, never mind swapping out barrels after 500rds, the NRA should concentrate on making it as cheap and as simple as possible to get new blood into the sport. The cost of shooting is a huge disincentive to beginners - I say that as someone who founded a university club.

I disagree with charging for certificates of competency and the bit in the latest journal threatening clubs with everything under the sun for using photocopies made me laugh. No wonder the NRA has a reputation for being tight-fisted. If it stopped trying to copy Ryanair by charging sky high prices for everything - 85p/rd for .308!!! - we might have a governing body that shooters want to join.

I expect an organisation ,that represents me as a member and wishes to grow, to have its own statement on such an event, by all means make other bodies aware in advance of the statement and agree wording if necessary, but to call yourself the National Rifle Association and direct the media to another organisation it seems as though the NRA is without a voice and happy to play second fiddle. Which to me shows lack of selfconfidence both in its present form and future direction.

I will second that one - even if it is the exact same wording as the BASC statement but with NRA substituted. The media (speaking with my day job hat on!) will go around all the shooting bodies and if a journalist with an agenda finds a contradictory statement, or even a lack of statement, we can twist that to suit. One statement from all bodies, posted on all their websites, is the safest way.

On a different note, does the NRA do anything with social media?

[Sandgroper]

BASC may be releasing statments on behalf of all shooting bodies, but that isn't how it appears. Because the NRA appears to be silent, BASC is getting the publicity and to it's members, it's doing it's job - this is why I feel the NRA comes in for so much stick. BASC is winning the publicity game and in the end that will cost the NRA dearly.

But its not a competition to see which organisation can express the most sympathy or make the most promises to its members or gain the most publicity - people have died and we need to respect that!

I never said it was, but I trying to be constructive by pointing out where I think the NRA is letting itself down.

Unfortunately, appearances count for a lot in this world and at times like this BASC appears to be doing all the work and the NRA appears to be silent.

[karen]

I disagree with charging for certificates of competency and the bit in the latest journal threatening clubs with everything under the sun for using photocopies made me laugh. No wonder the NRA has a reputation for being tight-fisted. If it stopped trying to copy Ryanair by charging sky high prices for everything - 85p/rd for .308!!! - we might have a governing body that shooters want to join.

On a different note, does the NRA do anything with social media?

Hi Gaz

Certificates of Competence are free to NRA members - we had to hire another member of staff to process them all so non-members are charged to cover the cost of the work. Why should NRA members subsidise non-members in this?

Please remember that the NRA does not want and did not ask for competency cards - they were foisted on us by the MoD and we have to make them work otherwise we would have lost a LOT of shooting around the country. If people photocopy them then that is fraud and if there was to be an accident and someone has a fraudulent card then the whole system would be in jeopardy and the MoD would pull the plug on civilian shooting on their ranges. It has happened and we have discovered at least one club photocopying cards.

Yes we have a Twitter page and we have used Facebook for events such as Bisley Live but recently the powers-that-be banned Facebook at work! Ho hum!

Love

karen

[artiglio]

Karen,

Thanks for your swift reply, I would echo an earlier comment about speaking from the heart. In such tragic circumstances all statements sound hollow, to those at its centre, but unfortunately in this age the public at large are used to hearing platitudes and self serving comment (I'm not defending it) its all part of modern life, and (again in my view) the NRA needs to engage at this level if it is to be seen as a viable force within the shooting community.

regards phil

[JonC]

I think one problem is that the NRA fails to publicise what it does achieve. Plenty of people complaining about the lack of benefits for members away from Bisley, but they rely on the NRA to keep civy shooters on MOD ranges. Would be nice if they offered an easy and discounted upgrade for members of associated clubs to full membership.

[IainWR]

- 85p/rd for .308!!!

Gaz

The stuff costs the NRA 79.6p per round, plus the interest on that 79.6p x 435000 x the time until we sell it, plus the cost of storing the rounds that we can't hold on site when the whole lot turns up at once, plus the cost of shipping that last 100k or so from where it's stored to Bisley, plus the cost of the staff to move it into and out of storage (except me - I handled every one of the 435000 rounds of RUAG bought in 2011 by the NRA at least twice, and some of them three or four times, FOR NOTHING), plus the cost of maintaining the storage, plus the cost of processing the sale, plus the cost of insuring it, plus the cost of the licences to hold it, plus . . .

If you want to save money, we have GGG (which has been used by a Gresham's pupil to shoot 50.10 at 600 yds) and PriviPartizan both at 55p. If you want the best value for money balance, of accuracy necessary at elite level on NRA TR targets against cost, I defy you to find a commercial round, available in the quantities we need, that does better than the RUAG .308". If you can find it and give me a contract that guarantees performance and delivery for the Meeting, I promise you that the NRA will use it as soon as the current contract expires.

Iain

[IainWR]

I think one problem is that the NRA fails to publicise what it does achieve. Plenty of people complaining about the lack of benefits for members away from Bisley, but they rely on the NRA to keep civy shooters on MOD ranges. Would be nice if they offered an easy and discounted upgrade for members of associated clubs to full membership.

That's a nice concept.

I'll pass that on to my semi-tame contact on the membership Committee!

Iain

[John MH]

Firstly I consider people bashing the NRA tiresome as most of those doing the bashing aren't NRA members (they might be members of an affiliated club but the only reason their club is affiliated is its a Home Office requirement and not because the club membership want to be affiliated). So don't bash the NRA unless you are a member. I am a member so I quite regularly bash them, they (the NRA and NSC) have been mismanaged for many years and whilst there are good people that work there, there is also lots of dead wood. Thankfully some of that dead wood has now been hacked out. The NRA does what it does and the NSC does what it does but it is a model that doesn't seem to work too well. The cost of maintaining the site is high so lots of maintenance doesn't get done but, quite frankly, many areas are pretty awful and should either be shut permanently or at least put out of use until sufficient funds are found to make the necessary basic improvements. The Butts on Century are particularly disgusting and are an accident waiting to happen, particularly when you see young teenagers and Cadets pulling targets over the unguarded filth invested cesspool of a target trench. When a serious accident does happen (not a shot related accident) and a Butt Marker is injured by a fall into a trench or by being hit by a heavy target when moving frames around the HSE will close the place down.

Just get a Work Place Risk Assessor down there and see what they make of it.

The firing points at 100, 200 and 400 yards are also neglected; not used as often or at all by TR fraternity but used by many others they are also poorly maintained. The last time I used an electronic target I wasted half the afternoon radioing the Range Office trying to get the thing to work, have things improved?

Lets see if the shake-up makes things better, only time will tell. I'm still a individual member though and will continue to be for the foreseeable future.

[IainWR]

most of those doing the bashing aren't NRA members (they might be members of an affiliated club but the only reason their club is affiliated is its a Home Office requirement and not because the club membership want to be affiliated). So don't bash the NRA unless you are a member.

JohnMH

Take much of what you say, but just to keep things straight, there is no requirement to be affiliated to the NRA in order to gain HO approval. If there are clubs out there being told so, please let me know in my official capacity.

Iain
Firearms Liaison Officer
NRA

[JonC]

BASC do something similar offering clubs and syndicates large discounts on indevidual membership. Its also worth noting that on various hunting forums when joing an organisation comes up, that insurance is often seen as an important reason. In my syndicate we have to have insurance to be members, and having insurance is seen as being a necessity when asking farmers to be able to use their land. The large wildfowling cluns still have a supprisingly loud voice within BASC, and their members will often turn up for AGMS.

And another thing... Any chance of being able to pay membership over several months. Most club memberships seem to renew in Jan, if I join the NRA as a full member, its another £70ish due at the same time as my club fees.

I think one problem is that the NRA fails to publicise what it does achieve. Plenty of people complaining about the lack of benefits for members away from Bisley, but they rely on the NRA to keep civy shooters on MOD ranges. Would be nice if they offered an easy and discounted upgrade for members of associated clubs to full membership.

That's a nice concept.

I'll pass that on to my semi-tame contact on the membership Committee!

Iain